PODCAST TRANSCRIPT | Episode 42 – How Can We Change the World – Part 8

Episode 42: How Can We Change the World – Part 8

Serene of Trim Healthy Mama is with me again for a third session. What a miracle. Serene shares testimonies of obstacles and difficulties she faced in embracing life. What does the Bible call a pregnant woman?

Announcer: Welcome to the podcast, From Our Home to Yours, with Nancy Campbell, founder and publisher of Above Rubies.

Nancy Campbell: Hello, precious ladies! And guess what? I've got Serene with me again! Oh! I'm just so grateful. So, one more session together with her. You are so blessed.

Last session, Serene was mentioning a Scripture in Genesis 2:7, and we looked it up in my Bible. I just looked it up in my Strong's Concordance, and it says chayim for life. But we did a little bit more study to find out, and found that yes, it's a plural word.

Serene: So, it's the Lord God who formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and then became a living soul. Well, apparently, the Hebrew for “breath of life” is neshamah, I'm probably not pronouncing it right, chayim. And “im” is plural.

So basically, it can be translated “the breath of lives.” Mum was saying, well, that makes sense, because when God breathed into Adam, Eve was inside of him, because he took Eve from his ribs.

Nancy: Yes, she was already there.

Serene: The other reason that Bible scholars say that it was plural was because when God breathed in the breath of life, Adam received two lives, in a way. His own, the fact that he was a living human being, and the fact that God's Spirit was put inside of him.

That is truly being really recreated! For we're not created to just be and live our life. When we're really to thrive and to live, we are created to be coupled with God's life, His Spirit inside of us.

What made me think of it is another book I was reading that used that term, “breath of life.” When it was breathed into Adam “the breath of lives,” they're bringing out how Adam was given the anointing and the command in Genesis to “be fruitful and multiply and to fill the earth.”

So, when he was given life, he was given the “breath of lives,” and the breath to want to continue in life.

Nancy: Yes, and God put that blessing on him. In fact, if any of you have my book, “Be Fruitful and Multiply,” you will see a chapter there which gives all the Scriptures, where every time God spoke about being fruitful, or spoke about someone having a baby, it always precedes the words with, “and God blessed them.” God blesses us to bring forth life. We can't even do it without the blessing of God.

Serene: I totally agree. I'm going to interrupt here. Boy, I'm a professional interrupter!

Nancy: Yes, that's good! That what you're made to do!

Serene: We've been talking about choosing life. Mum's been . . . the whole series . . . what is it called, Mum?

Nancy: Well, we're doing a series, it's “How Do We Change the World?”

Serene: Right!

Nancy: This subject is, of course, we've got to become adamant about how God feels about life.

Serene: And so we're on the subject about “breath of lives” being plural. It just made me think, well actually, my son Arden and his beautiful wife Esther just have received the miraculous news that they're almost nine weeks pregnant now with the most beautiful baby to come!

He was saying when he came home from their first sonogram midwife visit, that the midwife said these days now, they can detect that the DNA of the child is actually floating in the blood. They can find it in the mother's blood.

We're talking about “lives,” the breath of life. It's so interesting, and that's why I think the sad consequence of abortion, and God can take away all pain, and wipe away the tears. But the sad thing about abortion is the psychological damage done to the mother.

Because you can never get rid of your baby. And that's the thing. The baby lives on inside the mother, even when that baby grows up and moves away, and goes to a different country.

So, your children are knitted into your body, into your bones, into your brain. The mother carries stem cells of her child. They're mingled into hers, even though the child within her is a totally different human being, with a different beating heart, and different brain waves, and different DNA.

The mother does carry a part of her baby forever. So when we're talking about “breath of lives,” it just made me think of that awesome, the other, another amazing tidbit of information that helps us realize the horror of abortion, and the beauty of a mother whose children, like yours now, Mum, who are all up and out of the nest, and wandering around the whole world, different countries at all different times.

But you still carry them in your heart. That's why, I think when a mother thinks about her children, she clutches her heart. In a sense, she's still holding them when she clutches her heart.

Nancy: Exactly! And to this day, I mean, it's part of a mother when she has a baby, she's always swaying, because she's rocking her baby. After you've had babies, you don't stop doing that. Well, of course, I have grandbabies, and now great grandbabies who I still rock. But swaying now is just part of my being. I still can't stop swaying!

Serene: When you hear a baby cry, and you're not holding a baby, I start swaying, because I think it's going to help the baby!

Nancy: Exactly! Because motherhood is so a part of you. Isn't it amazing? Motherhood is not something that is making you smaller, or less powerful. It's making you more powerful as you carry these children, continually, for your whole life. It's unbelievable! Everything about motherhood is so amazing.

Serene: So, from, oh, I hate that word “fetal.” I know it's probably all wonderful and everything . . . I just like “baby”!

So anyway, fetal cells are probably sprinkled throughout a mother's brain. A study of women who had died in the seventies found that the heart of the woman had male DNA, a snippet from the Y chromosome in her brain, presumably from when her sons were in the womb.

Scientists often look for male DNA in a woman, because it's easier than distinguishing a daughter's DNA from her mother's. If DNA from daughters were included, the number of women whose children's cells are in their brains would probably be even higher.

It's so interesting how we carry them in our hearts and in our minds in this way, as well. You know, I'm an extremist in everything that I do. And I'm not saying that this is theologically correct, or even biologically correct, but sometimes, if I have a child that's sick, or a child that's, whatever . . . when I take communion, I know that through the Blood of Christ and His stripes we are healed . . . I take it like I'm taking it for them, because I feel like I've got their cells in my body.

Even when my son, Arden was battling cancer, and I'd be like, “Oh, Lord, we need You!” it would be like my heart was crying out like it was me that was sick. It's just so interesting, because that's the beauty of parenthood, that you don't ever really separate from your children.

That's where we do need to minister and reach out to those who have been victimized by abortion. It's not just the baby. Its society dumbing us all down, society hoodwinking us, demonic activity at work, pulling the wool over our eyes.

There are precious women, and precious young men even, they're finding out that even the men, they’re coming out that men who have sought counseling, young men are racked with grief. It comes out in different ways they actually don't even realize in some hearts. Their lives, they come to find out that since the abortion has happened in their lives, you can't separate yourself from the children.

So there is this need to outreach to the people who have been through abortion and have become aware now of the truth of life, and they need to be encouraged of God's forgiveness and His grace. It is only He who can wipe those tears away.

It's something, when you've had an abortion, you're still carrying that child. And there's that pain of that.

Nancy: Yes. You were mentioning something about the demonic powers before, Serene. You know, I have found ladies, that this issue is actually . . . I'm quite amazed, many times, to find that it's a real battle between the kingdom of God and the kingdom of Satan.

You can talk to a secular person about having children, and perhaps they see you. Maybe you have three, four, five children, and they say, “Oh, goodness, are these all yours?” Of course, you will answer them so positively, and say, “Oh, yes! We LOVE children! Don't you?”

They'll say, “Oh well. Good for you!” But they don't get mad about it. You know, “OK, that's not for me. OK, that's for you.”

But I have found, oh my, not every time of course, but sometimes when I have spoken to someone who knows the Lord, they walk with God, but you bring this subject up, and suddenly, it's World War III!

This violent reaction! Now what is that? I believe it's a battle, it's a battle for life! It seems that the battle is greater in the godly people, because Satan is out to destroy the godly seed.

Serene: That reminds me, Mum, of when I first got married.

Nancy: Oh yes! Oh my! Tell us that story.

Serene:  I was signed with a record company and they put a lot of money into us. When I first came and told them that I was getting married, they're like, “Well, go outside the door. Come back in, and we'll pretend we didn't hear that.”

I suppose you can't sell as many records and have the right appeal if you're married. (Laughs) And so, anyway, I remember the morning we were to sign a contract that I wouldn't have children for three years, at least.

Nancy:  Oooh. Christian?

Serene: Christian. And when they found out that I was just going to go ahead and have children because my husband and I (I was drawn to my husband because of the way he loved children). We went on dates when first our relationship was growing. We used to try to pick up as many children as we could, our nephews and nieces, and go to the park.

Our dates were all centered around children. That's how we enjoyed each other, was with children. I mean, there's many other reasons I love him, but he was a magnet to children. I loved that about him. So we were wanting children from the get-go.

When people close to us found out about that, not my mum and dad, but many others, we were faced with such strong opposition. We had people say, “You signed a contract to be part of this record label. We've heard about that.”

All those people leading our church said . . . we had people saying they wouldn't come to our wedding. We had people praying that we'd be sterile!

Nancy: This shows such a spiritual battle! It's outrageous!

Serene: On our honeymoon we were still on tour, and we had to go out the next two days after the wedding to go on tour. We had people trying to arrange that we had to sleep on the couch, and not in the bedroom like some of the other band members, because they didn't want us to have the babies.

It was just so strange, but I remember those first few months of being married. I was reading . . . Mum is amazing in the fact that she has had these beliefs her whole life. She raised us with Scripture, but she never forced these . . . I want to declare that right now.

She never raised us to be robots like, OK, I've got this revelation from God about life, and where life begins, and how the devil is after life, even in the form of contraception. But she never programmed that into us.

So when all this stuff was happening with the record company, and I came to her for advice, she never said, “Well, this is what you have to do! You have to go in there and tell them you're for life and contraception's wrong!”

She never said it. She said, “Oh, I'll pray for you, and go to the Scriptures.” She was so supportive, but she never told me what to do.

I just remember picking up a book, “Abortion and the Church.” It has that picture of the blood flowing down the steps of the church on the front. I was looking into .. . . even though I believed in children, because it was a love of mine. Maybe I didn't know all the Scriptures, but it was just an instinct to want that when I first got married.

But I was reading, and my husband was in the Army, and he had gone away and left at three o'clock in the morning. I just couldn't go back to sleep straightaway, so I picked up the book, “Abortion and the Church,” and I was reading it.

I fell asleep reading it. I must have turned onto my stomach somehow. I woke up to the feeling that my body was dead, but I was trapped inside my body. I could not move. I felt like there were a trillion camels on my back. The weight upon my back, it made me feel like my body would not obey me.

I wanted to move, to look around the room, because I sensed such an evil presence. At this time in my life, I had never experienced any demonic realm at all. I was raised in such a godly home, never ever experienced anything evil.

The shutters were shaking in my room. The windows were locked tight. It was our apartment when we were first married. The shutters were moving back and forth, like sh-sh-sh, making a rattling sound. I couldn't move. I was screaming inside of my mind, “Turn around to see who's in the room! Turn around!” And I couldn't.

I remembered to just claim the Name of Jesus. I could hardly get the word out, “Jesus!” And when I said it, everything stopped. I got up, and I looked at what was in my home. It was the book, “Abortion in the Church.”

That was the time in our lives when I was going through what was I going to choose. Was I going to fold and say, “OK, we won't have children for blah, blah, blah, because they put a million bucks into us, or whatever . . . I need to fold.”

“Or am I going to stand with my convictions? I want to have a baby.” And Arden, our first-born, was a honeymoon baby. It was him that the devil was trying to stop. But that was interesting. I found that I actually experienced the heavy opposition of the demonic realm.

It came to me choosing life in my mind . . . like OK, I'm going to choose this path of choosing life. But it was also the devil trying to stop somebody coming into the world.

It was demonic as people actually stopped being my friends because I was going to choose to have a baby.

Nancy: You can't believe it, can you? And maybe some of you have had to face difficult things like this. In fact, some of you may be thinking, “Oh, goodness, you're talking all about this life, but you don't know what I had to face to have a baby! You don’t know our circumstances, I mean, how can we even afford to have another baby?!”

You know, there's so many things that can come against us in the natural to have a baby. I remember reading a little line, way back when I was having my children. It just said, “There is never a convenient time to have a baby.”

That is so true. If we want to find the time when we think it's perfect, and convenient, and everything is going well in our home, and it's going to fit, and it's going to be right, we'll never find that time! So we never find, in our eyes, a convenient time.

But! We find, we get pregnant, oh, wow! Oh goodness me! But it will fit in. The baby fits in. The baby, ohhh, it fits in God's timing. Always in God's . . . a convenient timing.

Serene: I find actually the baby is a way of God saying, “He gently leads those with young” (Isiah 40:11). God's way of saying, “Well, I'm going to help you to settle down,” because oftentimes in a pregnancy, you'll just get more tired, and you'll need to take that nap. Or when your baby's here, and you have to sit down to nurse.

You actually have more of a restful life. You've got the hormone relaxin flowing through your body. You're actually more of a relaxed person.

Nancy: Absolutely!

Serene: I find that, when I have another baby, my oldest children in the home get a softer and more devoted mother.

Nancy: Oh yes. I know, because that love, that oxytocin, that love and the nurture, and the joy, and the calmness that comes from oxytocin and prolactin that's just flowing out of you when you're a nursing mother . . . it affects the whole family, doesn't it?

In fact, did you ever read my article, I think it was Above Rubies #92, How to Live Stress-Free in a Stress-filled World? I talked about the hormone oxytocin, and oh, God is so good! I mean, when you're in the home, and you're embracing babies, and birthing and nurturing babies, and nursing them at the breast, you are just oozing oxytocin, which is the stress-free hormone!

This is what God intends for us as mothers, to enjoy this kind of lifestyle. But then again, I know, we were talking about some of you facing, oh, you face all different kinds of things.

Now Serene, what about that challenging time in your life, when you adopted children from Liberia, you adopted your own. And then, you even took into your home some others of people who just weren't able to cope with the ones they adopted. I think you had eight adopted children in your home at the same time!

Serene: Teenagers, all at the same time!

Nancy: And all in rebellion. I think that might have been about the most challenging and difficult time of your whole life.

Serene: I remember falling and screaming on the kitchen floor, saying, “I can't do it anymore!”

Nancy: Yes, Serene went through a very, very horrific time.

Serene: Well, my adrenals got flatlined, and I was just . . . but you know what happened? Oh, I love people say, OK, wow.

Nancy: But of course, you got, you know, because of your adrenals, they were wiped out. You got into these panic attacks, which were just, well, I mean, they just totally immobilized you.

Serene: I really thought I was dying, like many times.

Nancy: We were taking you up to the hospital all the time!

Serene: I was saying good-bye. Well, look after my children. I literally thought I was leaving my body.

Nancy: And so, going through that, how can you have another baby?

Serene: Well, I had so many people advising me, you know, you've done your thing now, you've done your stint. Pull back, cover your wagons, you've done a good job, now go back and relax. But you know, there was a time that I decided to believe that.

I started really looking after myself in this self-absorbed way, like putting masking tape over every little blue light in the room and wearing a mask over my eyes so that all the melatonin, blah, blah, blah, blah, all this stuff. I was taking all these supplements, and I was getting sicker and sicker because I was getting self-absorbed.

Then I felt like, you know what? I just had this picture of me being in birth. It was all of a sudden, in my brain, and I couldn't get it out of my head. I started longing for another baby. We got pregnant with Breeze. She was called Breeze because we wanted the Breeze of God, the soft breeze after the tornado that came through our lives. You know, it felt like a tornado.

But you know what happened? The pregnancy healed me. The hormones that . . . I got a burst of hormones. After 24 you're in decline hormonally, unless you're breastfeeding or pregnant. Then you're getting a surge. I got a surge of all these wonderful hormones in my body.

It wasn't necessarily a pregnancy where I had the perfect nap every day. Maybe I did, like five times, get a nap, I don't know. But the pregnancy healed me. I've since researched that, how pregnancy can reset your hormones, and your levels of your adrenals. I'm healed.

Nancy: I know. Isn't that amazing? Could you imagine, could you even imagine if you'd stopped with Breezy? I mean, she is the most beautiful, beautiful child. Nine years old. And now, since Breezy, you've had Haven, who is the most adorable child.

Serene: And Haven. And Haven's pregnancy was a total spiritual journey. You see, I think when you're pregnant, you become pregnant spiritually too, in a way, I think, if you allow God to. Every pregnancy, I feel like God's conceived something inside of me spiritually and brings it to birth.

In Haven's pregnancy, God was doing a spiritual awakening of me, that He was my Rest. And as I called her Haven Rest, because the part of being anxious and suffering all these panic attacks, I feel like, in Haven's pregnancy was when I really let go, to just finally trust the Lord at such a deep level. And Haven Rest came along.

Each baby, and then, after Haven, then we had Remmy, which is just, he's the most incredible gift. And now our little baby, Solly, who is blue-eyed. Remmy and Solly are blue-eyed. All my other children are brown, and deep brown eyes as you can get. No one ever thought that my husband and I could have a blue-eyed little one too. People say we've run out of brown, but we'll see!

Nancy: (laughing) Well, now you're just hoping you'll fit some more in yet!

Serene: Well, that's the sad thing, you see. Now come this fall, and I know, I'm all about embracing the season. I'm not going to mourn over a season that God wants me to change into a new season. Like when I'm your age, Mum. I'm going to embrace my empressness.

I don't want to embalm an 18-year-old in my head. I don't want to constantly want to live the glory days of 18. I don't want that now, now I'm forty, how old am I? 42? I want to be queen now. When I'm your age, I want to move on, and be an empress.

I was just reading the other day, how the glory of an older man . . . the glory of a young man is his strength, but the glory of an older man is the hoary-headed gray hair. It's beauty. It's beauty. So we want to move on.

So I want to embrace when, like my sister Evangeline, to embrace the season now she's no longer having babies. And she's off with her husband kayaking, and doing all these adventures, and it's great! It's a new season. She can go off and all these amazing witnessing places where angels fear to tread, couldn't make it through anymore. All that to say, what was I saying? (laughter)

Nancy: You were hoping that you would be blessed again . . .

Serene: So I'm still hoping, but now I'm 42! Whoo! Every baby from here on out is going to be a beautiful, amazing gift. Every baby will be like, will this be the last? I'm not sure, but it's going to be a . . . it's over too soon.

And that's the sad thing about contraception that's permanent, like tying of the tubes, and things like that. Vasectomies, especially tying of the tubes, because I've been researching that lately. They say that when a young woman does that, when she's in her twenties or early thirties, she has a . . . it's called a . . . there's a syndrome actually called Tubes Tied Syndrome, I don't know.

But it's actually where there's certain hormonal issues, and heavy bleeding, and anemia, and all this stuff that can come through tying the tubes.

Nancy: They say that most times, the sterilization of the woman leads to hysterectomy. That's just where it ends up.

Serene: It's a sad thing. I know some friends who have had their tubes tied, and one is so severely anemic. Her periods have gotten heavier and heavier and heavier and heavier. That's one of the symptoms of having the tubes tied.

But the sad thing is, you see, it's over, quick. You're only fertile for a certain window, depending on when you get married. So you get married in your mid-twenties...

Nancy: By your mid-forties, you're finished!

Serene: Well, let's pray not! But you know, some women, who start to cycle earlier in life, there's only a certain window, and then you have your tubes tied until you're 80-something.

Nancy: When you think about it, your time of visitation is a very short window. It's only about 20 years of your whole life. You may live to 80 or 90.

Serene: Long time for a woman 23 or so.

Nancy: Hallelujah! Yes! Well, that reminds me of another Scripture, which I think really exposes something. It's in that beautiful story of when Sarah conceived. This is chapter 18 of Genesis.

Serene: But it's also fun. While you're looking up chapter 18 . . . you know, when my son walked down the aisle, uh, he didn't walk down the aisle! When his wife walked down the aisle, he walked me down the aisle to my spot before the wedding began. But I was holding a baby, and here's my son getting married. It was fun. I'm like, wow, this is a great adventure, I've got one now getting married, and I still have a baby in my arms.

And now they're having a baby, and I have grandchildren already through my adopted children. Now the new generation, Mum, some of my oldest sisters' children are having babies now too. It's so fun, because they learn off of me, because I'm having babies, and they're asking me advice.

But I'm asking them advice, of all the things that you forget when you're an older mother. You forget all the wonderful, energetic ideas you have of early motherhood.

I, the other day, got all the young mums, all my nieces in the room, and I asked them, “So how do you train a child to go to sleep again? I forgot. Can you all tell me?” And they said all these wonderful, energetic ideas. I'm so racked now, in my nights, that the babies just overwhelm now, and I'm heeding their advice.

It's fun, though, to give and to take, when you've been through the gamut, and you're along the season of motherhood, you have these relationships now with these new mums. You can learn from each other and have that great relationship.

Nancy: They come up with these great ideas, which they will most probably begin to drop a little bit of, along the way. Because, have you found too, that, you know, in mothering, you do just get a little more lax, and you relax more, and you just enjoy your babies.

Serene: And they are a little bit more well dressed, and their hair's always perfect. Arden is sitting here, he does the technical part of my Mum's podcast, he was my best dressed. And his hair was always swept to the side, perfectly. All the others, well, (laughter) their older sisters keep them looking not so “ragamuffin.”

Nancy: OK, here's Genesis 18, and this is where God came, and He promised Sarah and Abraham that they would have a son. Let's see, where are we? They visited them, the angels came, and they said unto Abraham, “Where is Sarah?” And he said, “Behold, in the tent.” She was in the heart of the home.

“And he said, I will certainly return unto thee according to the time of life; and lo,” Behold! “Sarah will have a son.” Now that's a very interesting phrase. Have you read that before? The time of life the Bible talks about?

Serene: I've never thought of it like that.

Nancy: Yes, the time of life. It says also, not only in this passage, but in another passage, and in this passage,  it speaks of it two times. We know how Sarah laughed, and because she was old.

“And the Lord said unto Abraham, 'Wherefore did Sarah laugh, saying, shall I bear a child, who am old?' Is there anything too hard for the Lord? At the time appointed, I will return unto thee, according to the time of life, and Sarah shall have a son.”

So two times He said those words, “the time of life.” Now I believe, this passage doesn't tell us, but I do believe that part of the wonderful miracle of Sarah conceiving again was that God restored her cycle. She was well past her cycle, but God restored it again. That made her young and beautiful again, and more desirable to her husband.

When we have our cycle, we have every month a time of life in that window of ovulation. That time when we are fertile, that's the only time we can conceive life. It's the time of life, the very powerful time that we have in our lives. We are blessed, God has blessed us, dear mothers, with this beautiful time of life every month.

And so, as Sarah's cycle was restored, God was able to come to her, and just bring conception to her, during that time of life. Because, did you know, the only way you can get conception is if God visits you?

It also tells us, a few chapters on, that, when that happens, that God visited. Let's see where it is . . .

Serene: While you're looking that up, when I was talking about that Scripture, “He breathes the breath of life,” and we can take it as breath of life. But see, life cannot come from inside of this earthly sphere. He has to breathe the breath of it. We can't create life. So we can't say, “Well, my husband and I, we decided to have life.”

We get to open our hearts to it and open our lives to it. But it is God Who breathes it. Which one of the guys in the Bible said, the wife came, was it Leah? No, was is Rachel who said, “Why can't you give me a child?” And he's like . . .

Nancy: I'm sure it was Rachel.

Serene: And he's like, “Am I God!? Give you a child?” Because it's God, it's God that opens the womb. It's about also, the sadness of abortion, too. It’s God, God's chosen the breath of life, even in rape. And that's what I wanted to say too, it's awfully interesting . . .  while you're looking up that Scripture.

They say, scientists, psychologists actually, are finding out that abortion compounds the rape trauma. Many women have reported in counseling sessions with psychologists that suffering from the trauma of abortion was harder long after the rape trauma had faded. They suffered the trauma of the abortion.

Randy Alcorn says in his book that “it's hard to imagine a worse therapy for a woman who has been raped, than then giving her the guilt and turmoil of having killed her child.” Now, the reason why people have been like, “Why couldn't you kill the baby? You can't even talk about that, how you have no place.”

But the reason why I feel like I can even mention this is because the church can be so strong against abortion, but some Christians can think, well...

Nancy: We can accept rape or incest.

Serene: I grew up with a friend, a great friend, and she was a rape victim. She was a child of a rape. Beautiful girl. She had a wonderful mother.

Nancy: I know, I was just going to talk about her. She chose to keep her.

Serene: If you feel like you can't handle the psychologicalness of raising a child, you can give it to adoption, and suffer less trauma, knowing you didn't kill the child, and you didn't have the two traumas of rape and then that . . . you can give it up for adoption.

You don't have to, you're not forced. There's so many people wanting to have a baby, and so many people open to that. But this girl, talented and beautiful . . .

Nancy: Wasn't she beautiful? And loved God and served God will all her heart.

Now one time I put out a post about abortion, saying that really, we can't even use rape or incest as an excuse, because this is not something that is me, this is another life. It is murder, no matter what. I got a load of responses from women who were rape victims.

And they said, “Oh, Nancy! I just want to share my testimony. I was born out of rape.” But many of them said, “I'm now married today, I have children, I have this blessed life, I have a beautiful husband, I am so grateful for life!”

One said, “If only all of us, I know so many of us, if we could just stand on the steps up there in Washington, and just let them know the blessing that we are alive, and we've brought more beautiful children into the world!”

Serene: You know, if a father has committed a crime, does it not mean that the child goes to jail for it?

Nancy: No.

Serene: No, they're a new child, they are a new human being, and they suffer consequences and be killed, because somebody has done a crime.

Nancy: And let me just give you these few Scriptures. Yes, God, it says that God visited Sarah. He actually visited her during that time of life. If you're a darling, lovely Mummy, God wants to visit you. Visit you, and the only time He can really visit you, and give you this miracle, is in this beautiful time of life during the month.

And the same with Hannah. You remember Hannah, she dedicated Samuel to the Lord. Then, when she came back after giving him to the Lord, and leaving him in the Temple, she comes back, and the Bible says, “and God visited,” do you get that word? “Visited Hannah,” and she had five more children.

He visited her five more times! Isn't that amazing? So this time of life . . . now it is so sad that even many Christians, mothers acting through ignorance, and not understanding, will make this a time of death. They say, “Oh, no, God! Don't come near me during this time of life!”

They're making sure they're using contraception, or they may even sterilize. They will do anything to make sure that God cannot get near them during this time of life. But what do we do? We're cringing from God, we're saying, “No, God, I don't believe that Your way is best!” God's ways are always the best!

Serene: I just think about sometimes, the incredible love parents have for their children, the incredible love. You know, you go out to hospitals, and you see these parents weeping over the bedsides of children with cancer, or with anything, or if a child departs from this world, just the grief, the grief, the terrible grief.

I've heard people say that, you know, who have had children who have passed from this earth, that they live one foot in heaven, because they're not normal again, because their child is dead, and so part of them is dead. I don't know how to explain it.

But when you see all the actual things that they're saying, “I don't want.” “Oh, I don't want to do this.”  “Oh pregnancy, I couldn't handle it!” Or blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Complain, complain, don't want, don't want, put the wall up, put the contraceptive to visitation.

But when the baby actually comes, it's like, they would run in front of a train! They would cut off their leg! They would do anything for the child! It's so funny, because reality is what they're going to treasure the most. Isn't that funny?

Nancy: And often, it's because of the indoctrination, really, that comes throughout society, which comes from the very pit of hell. But you know what? We've gone over time again. And wow, we keep talking.

Serene: Can I interrupt one more thing?

Nancy: Yes.

Serene: When we were talking about the rape and the incest thing . . . you know, the soul is not the soul of the person who did the crime. The child has a soul. It's totally separate. The soul, this unique human being who has received the breath of life and is being visited by God with life, that has got nothing really to do with the DNA that makes its eyes a certain color, and everything like that.

Just as much as there are young teenage girls who have to realize the father of a one-night stand is a bit of a drongo, you know, a bit of a drughead or whatever. They've left that boyfriend, and they're trying to get their life on track. But they love their child.

You know, they just consider it may be like a teenage oops, or whatever. But they go on to be a single mom, or maybe getting married, and having a new adoptive father for their child. But they love their child.

Just as much as maybe there's a teenage boy who's a bit of a derelict. It still has the genetics of that derelict. It doesn't mean, they don't think of this child as an intractable, evil, whatever, child.

You see the parallels to a rape or incest. Just because they have the same DNA of somebody who committed a crime, or the same DNA of someone who just wasn't, you know, didn't have the heart to even stick around for the baby, or have the heart to even, or even ask to take her for an abortion. You know, wanted to kill the baby.

There was a father who wasn't all that and some, he wasn't a great stand-up guy to be proud of. They still go ahead in most, in a lot of cases, and have these babies. Do you see the parallel? Can you help me describe it?

Just because they have the genetics of a father, does not necessarily, I mean, you have a rapist that did that terrible crime . . .

Nancy: That new baby in the womb is a new person designed by God.

Serene: All these single moms that are raising these beautiful children, they're not thinking of the father, they're not thinking about it in their head, I don't think the whole time, about this awful DNA of the father. They just move on, and raise this beautiful child, because it's a unique soul.

I'm trying to say that about the rape and incest thing. Their unique soul has nothing to do with the genetics of the eye color, or the hair color, or whatever. Many times, these fathers are not in the child's life.

Nancy: We have adoptions. We have, you know, all kinds of things, different ways, yes, it happened in their lives before, but . . . the most beautiful, beautiful children in the world.

But, one little thing, and we've gone overtime. I just came to learn about this, and I think it's something that is worth noting. That is, the National Safe Haven Alliance. Have you heard about it? It is in every state.

It is an alliance that is available, and you can go onto the Internet, just look up National Safe Haven Alliance. Or go to their Facebook, and it will tell you where, in every single state, where a mother can take the baby.

Now some mothers, they are just in the most terrible circumstances, they have got no way of looking after their baby. But they don't have to abort it! Because there are these places— often a hospital, or a fire station, or police station. Every state has their own places where they can go.

They can take this baby, up to three days old. Some states it's up to 30 days, some 60 days, but I notice that most were up to three days. If they take it in that time, they can give the baby. That baby will be taken, looked after, and put up for adoption, with so many hundreds of couples waiting for babies.

So there is no need, ever, to abort a baby because a young mother is in terrible, difficult circumstance. We have provision in our nation for these babies to be cared for. So, make a note of that. You often may hear of someone in dire circumstances, a young mother in desperate circumstances. It's good that we can know this, so that there does not have to be abortion, or even, like in New York, these late-term abortions, which are so horrific.

But, time to stop!

“Oh Father, we just thank You, thank You, thank You, thank You, and praise You, that You are the Life-Giver. We belong to a Kingdom of Life. Lord God, help us to be those who are also always on Your side, always standing for life, from the beginning of life, from conception, even Lord, understanding that You see life begins in the sperm Rght up to, Lord, ‘til the moment that You take us, we'll always be standing for life.

I pray, Father, that you will bless every mother, precious mother, Lord. Some are facing difficulties, financially, physically, emotionally. I just pray for them. I ask that You come, Lord, and You will show forth Your mighty power in their lives, and You will encourage them.

For Lord God, You always bring us through. Lord, no matter what we go through, we think things are impossible, but Lord God, You never fail us. You always bring us through. And I pray that You'll fill them with hope and trusting You in a way that they've never known before. Pour out Your blessing upon their homes. In Jesus' Name, Amen.”

We are currently out of stock of the book, BE FRUITFUL AND MULTIPLY. However, we have it in audio book which you can order from the following link: http://tinyurl.com/BeFruitfulAudioUS